Film school--is it worth it?

Maty · Aug 21, 2006

Hi,

My aspiration, in the long run, is to be writing and directing for film. I believe that in order to do so properly I need to acquire a strong base and understanding of all the technical elements involved in the process of production, from camera operation, to lighting, to editing, etc. Ultimately, I believe the best way of learning would have been to join an able crew, and learn from people who do what they do best. But that seems quite impossible to me; unfortunately, with all my good intention and abilities, I doubt anyone would take a person with no technical experience or background in the field under his wing. So I started looking into film schools.

My first problem lays with the courses. As I said, the reason I consider attending a film school is to have access to equipment and technical knowledge which I would otherwise not be able to acquire by myself--whereas courses such as film history, creative writing etc. (although I’m sure they can be very interesting) I will be able to learn on my own, and for a fraction of the cost. (That is to say nothing about elective courses, which have nothing to do with the industry)

My second problem (or rather question) is regarding the broadness and intensity of the knowledge I would actually acquire. I have in my area (Toronto, Canada) a few alternatives to choose from, mainly, a four-year program at Ryerson University costing approx. $26,000, and an intensive (according to advertisement) 15-month program at the Toronto Film School, for the same sum. Each and every institution promises to bring their graduates to an "industry-level" upon graduation, yet I cannot help but feel a bit skeptical about such a statement. Moreover, upon doing some research to find out what people who had previously attended film schools could actually say in their behalf, the most recurring statement was that they "met a lot of people and made voluble connections" (or something along these lines). This is NOT the reason for which I plan to attend an educational institution, to say the least... As to the content of these programs, all I could find were short and somewhat vague descriptions, which merely left me even more puzzled then before.

At the bottom line, what I am getting at is that $26,000 is A VERY big monetary investment for me to make, and I cannot find any means of ascertaining whether it will actually be justified by what I will end up receiving in return. I'm afraid I might find myself a year (or four) from now, fresh out of school, and with nothing to show for it except for some graduation papers, a list of contacts, and a $26,000 loan hanging over my shoulders.

Lastly, there is the option of investing some of this money towards a decent HDV camera and a few good books, and slowly learn on my own. Yet, as much as I tend to favor this approach, it has its own drawbacks; mainly where I started from, that with a camcorder and a few books I can only do so much, while there is so much technical equipment and knowledge which I fail to see a way of obtaining or attaining on my own. Even more importantly, I would have nothing to do with film, and I don't think I'll be able to learn and build high theoretical constructs without feeling it with my own hands...

Well, this is pretty much my dilemma spread-out on paper. My hope is that people here might have some useful insights, which may lead me to a fresh perspective on the subject. I thank anyone who have read this far, and would greatly appreciate any comments or advices you might care to make.

Thank you.

Kim Welch · Aug 23, 2006

BIG QUESTIONS

BIG QUESTIONS

One of the issues that comes up on a regular basis is, “should I go to film school or should I go get any job in the industry and work my way up” I have heard recommendations on both sides of this issue. Some say go to work and get all the experience you can. And, some say go to school and get the education, learn the basics and make connections before you start to work in the big bad industry.

It might be better if you are very talented and know that you will not fair well in a four year institution to give it a full go working your way up. These days there are so many films being made that if you are not big on making lots of money you can get gigs where you get all kinds of experience but no money. I think that working on films that are going to be entered in film festivals is a key in this strategy.

I attended the UFVA conference in Orange County hosted at the new Marion Knott Studios at Chapman University. I asked the question and found the answers to be pretty much the same as before but slanted towards formal education. Some Big Time filmmakers give new hires an extra look. And, they give special consideration if they are Alumni from the school of the Job seeker.

I don’t want to knock the people who learned coming up through the ranks but they sure made a case for making connections. Film School connections through classmates and school Alumni can really give a career lift off.

I think it is better if you have the opportunity to go to a University but if you can not afford to or you are not in the position then I think there are many alternatives that include working as an assistant on a production, going to workshops, working on low budget films for credits.

Though I am a supporter of the formal education I do not think that schools have a corner on education. I do believe that good books, a good mentor and determination will take you a long way. We are all learning each day and if you can stay in tune with this and get the basics down you will do well. Also, experience is very valuable and shows people that you can actually do the jobs they require for production.

I think part of making the decision really depends on where a person is and what opportunities are open to them. If a person can not get the money together to go to school then find low pay or no pay work that puts you close to the people doing the job that you want to learn to do.

I think the most important thing is a love for making movies. I think the passion and desire to make movies is what drives one to learn as much as possible in all stages of learning. I also think determination is a major factor.

People in the movie making business have a love for making movies and there is a passion that drives them. This is a tough business. It is hard and it takes lot of hard work and guts but I feel it is worth it.

Glurrk · Aug 23, 2006

Here's my experience as a 4 and a half year film student: It was fine, back in the early 1990's- However, during the final two years I found myself taking fewer courses and instead shooting featurettes and shorts for course credit. If you think you have a good grasp of various aspects of film but would like some formal education in others, I say go part-time and grab courses in areas you find yourself lacking skills in.

Nowadays, doing your own movies is ridiculously easy, with the availability of home-editing systems and relatively affordable HDV cameras- I would have KILLED to get my hands on these things back in college!

Also, why take a dull class about the history of film, when you can grab the DVD of Citizen Kane and read the production notes and listen to an audio commentary about the movie? (Beats writing a term paper, doesn't it?) :wink:

I hope this makes sense to you. Please get back to us about your decision.

aramikvideo · Aug 23, 2006

I'd like to humbly throw my one and a half cents in if I may. This is a hotly debated topic on just about every site like this one. I've asked the same question because I'm a family man and starting a four year university program at 38 isn't plausible. What I've done is research the topic and made some contacts simply by being aggressive and searching them out. My "contacts", who don't know one another, agree that it's all about skills, contacts, and most importantly, your precious demo reel. You need to be able to directly show what you can do and a degree doesn't do that for you.
I'm pro-education but I believe education can be gained in ways other than at a university. Heck, I've taught myself Final Cut just by sheer effort, passion, and a bit of help from "Final Cut for Dummies." I'm certainly no expert but just the fact that I got over the learning enough to edit my latest industrial video project exclusively with the program is something I thought would never happen. Again, it was my sheer passion and joy in what I was doing that helped me to succeed.
I live in Toledo, Ohio and there is very little here to satisfy my cinematic urges. One of my contacts is a film professor at a local university and he is starting to organize various workshops. I think I will take advantage of the opportunity as it is obviously much cheaper than attending the university.
When I was younger I think I had the "I want to be the next Steven Spielberg" syndrome. Well, I've gotten past that. Now, I just want to spend time learning the art and enjoying the trip along the way.

Maty · Aug 24, 2006

First of all, I'd like to thank you guys for taking the time to read my questions and offer your ideas. I am still far from making a decision; it weighs heavy on me, and I want to be sure I've done my research thoroughly before I make-up my mind.

I believe all three replies touched the subject of working in the industry. I've been thinking about it myself for quite a while, only I'm not sure how can I really go about it with no experience to offer. I found a program called Film-connection, which got me excited at first, but after some research turned out dubious. They claim to offer an internship program, where they act as a mediator between you and a prospect employer. You get your education by working on an actual set while, simultaneously, leaning your theory at home. Although this particular program seems to be a fraud, the idea is very appealing, and I wonder how come it doesn’t work this way in reality. I mean, an employer can benefit from two extra hands on set, whose sole coin-of-exchange is knowledge to satisfy their hungry mind. And the student, well, he has the world to gain for offering his hard work. As far as I can see, it’s a win-win situation. (While, in the rare case of an unproductive student, or an unbeneficial employer, nothing is bounding the two together.)
However--I guess there’s not much point in discussing good, yet non-existing options…better focus on the subject at hand.

KimWelch, if I understand correctly, you suggest taking the school if one can afford it. Now, my problem is not getting the money--it’s repaying it

. On a serious note, I can take a loan, but a loan is not a free ride--it’s a heavy burden. Therefore, my question is whether a film school will actually warrant such an investment, or, in other words, if I am to make such an investment, I want to be damn sure it would be a profitable one.
1) In terms of the actual knowledge I will acquire (both practical, and theoretical), and
2) In terms of future work opportunities. (Emphasis is on the first)
Now, while I understand that a concept such as knowledge cannot be measured exactly, I believe it can be measured relatively; for example whether, based on what I might have learned in school, I'd be able to participate as a key member of a production crew, or would I have gained only some level of familiarity with the equipment, but not enough to perform professionaly?

This brings me to the subject of my next question: the difference between possible schools. For instance, if I take the two from my initial post: Ryerson University offers a 4-year program for $26,000 CA. The Toronto Film School offers a 15-month program for the same amount of money. Now, on the one hand, I get almost three extra years at Ryerson for the price of one at the TFS. On the other, I’m not sure whether knowledge is something to be bought in “bulk”… What I mean is, if for example (I’m not sure whether this is the actual case or not) the 15 month program in the TFS is very intensive and hands-on, offering more time for experimenting and experiencing the equipment, while two of the four years at Ryerson would be spent discussing the “pros and cons of modernization”, the “social aspect of films and moral duties of film-makers”, or elective courses discussing the effects of global warming on the habitation and reproduction of Siberian Tigers--the 15 month program may not only offer more knowledge and experience, but also save three years of my life (and, possibly, a few thousand gray-cells in my brain). (No personal affront to Ryerson is intended). However, if I flip this coin, Ryerson is a University; would university documentation have more bearing then a private school when seeking a job? (I mean, If I’m paying for a paper, better make sure it holds some “industry value”)

(First-hand information of these two instituions would be greatly appreciated. However, any comment about the scenario may prove helpful--so don't hasitate to give your personal opinion or experiences if you care to do so)

And that brings me to my final question (for now at least). Wherever I turn, a career in the film-industry and the word “connections” seem almost synonyms with each other. Frankly, I never liked all the “hand-washing-hand--scratching back, or--“insert gesture here” approach. I always hoped (and here I do not speak only of film) to succeed by virtue of my own merit, rather then by favors from people I know. My question is: are those ways really rooted so deeply into the industry, or can one make it without friends, favors, pulls or bureaucracy--just by doing good? (Not that I have anything against friendship, only against this kind of friendships). I asking only because, well, this is my only clash with this profession; I want to learn how to make movies, not how to manipulate people.

Again, I will appreciate all comments. Thank you.

PS: Taking shorter courses and seminars while learning by myself is also something I have been considering. I think it’s a pretty good alternative, at least in allowing you some more budget control, so that if you took a certain seminar which, upon reflection, you find was not very essential, at least it did not cost you (relatively) very dearly. Thank you, aramikvideo, for your one-and-a-half cents, my hat is always open :wink:.

If any of you have good instruction books in mind, I’d love to get some names, lighting, cameras, and “the works”. (Please, no books from the “for Dummies” series. No offence to those who use them, but I find the name to be slightly too self-implying)

And, Glurrk, unfortunately I’m not familiar with Citizen Kane… I take it that you recommend it?

dh90210 · Aug 24, 2006

there's a lot of stuff that books can never teach you - as opposed to things a vet can teach you. filmschools are great - if you know which one to choose. maty, if ever you are in asia, check out http://filmschool.ph. they got mentors/faculty from hollywood. hope this helps ^_^

Invisibl · Oct 10, 2006

Great job plugging your school (or atleast a school you have an affiliation with) lol. Maty, I would love to respond more in depth to your previous posts, but I unfortunately do not have the time at the moment

. I will instead post some links to other places of study in Ontario that might interest you hopefully

http://www.amazon.com/Video-Filmmaking/lm/R1WG6H2HMB3D41
http://www.amazon.com/Best-books-on-Editing-and-Filmmaking/lm/32WFOW8LR1QH4
http://www.amazon.com/gp/richpub/li...m_fullview_fullview_col_1/002-4275948-0973630
http://www.amazon.com/gp/richpub/sy...t_fullview_fullview_col_1/002-4275948-0973630
http://www.amazon.com/gp/richpub/sy...t_fullview_fullview_col_3/002-4275948-0973630
http://www.amazon.com/gp/richpub/sy...t_fullview_fullview_col_2/002-4275948-0973630
http://www.amazon.com/gp/richpub/li...m_fullview_fullview_col_1/002-4275948-0973630
http://www.amazon.com/gp/richpub/li...m_fullview_fullview_col_2/002-4275948-0973630
http://www.amazon.com/gp/richpub/li...m_fullview_fullview_col_3/002-4275948-0973630
http://www.amazon.com/gp/richpub/sy...t_fullview_fullview_col_1/002-4275948-0973630
http://www.amazon.com/gp/richpub/sy...t_fullview_fullview_col_2/002-4275948-0973630
http://www.amazon.com/gp/richpub/li...m_fullview_fullview_col_1/002-4275948-0973630
http://www.amazon.com/gp/richpub/li...m_fullview_fullview_col_2/002-4275948-0973630

Reminiscence · Oct 10, 2006

Film school--is it worth it?

To answer your question, and I like to mix things up a bit, NO film school is not worth it. Using the money that you would´ve wasted on film school can go a long way. Now let´s say you have a camera already or access to one, preferably digital, and you have a pc/mac to do editing, then you´re already one step closer to making films. Think about it, what is better than actually doing it. While you would´ve waited a year or so before even making a short in film school, you can do it NOW in your backyard aka city. Get some books and browse some online forums if you have any questions. Go to the local film club if you have one, or even a film studio. Speak to people. Decide on the pace of progress you wanna make. Don´t let anyone decide it for you. Be creative and realistic, don´t be in debt and without a job. Film school doesn´t guarantee you a career, making your own movies doesn´t even, but at least you will be so many steps ahead than those rich pricks going to film school thinking they can tell a story to the world. As an artist you should not have any boundaries on what you wanna put on tape or film, only the limitations of your imagination and creativity will judge that. Rambling on and on I am.

Some books to recommend, which I saw were mentioned in the amazon postings.

1. MAKE YOUR OWN DAMN MOVIE!!! <--- hilarious and enough inspiration for you to start a fire, to capture that fire truck shot to up your production value, that you always dreamt of.

2. Rebel without a crew <--- Inspirational, but a pipe dream that happens once every fall.

3. $30 Film School <--- Another great read and gives you enough info and ideas to do your own thing...

Remember there are loads of books out there trying to explain to you the technicalities of filmmaking. And they promise you whatever. At the end of the day, who wants to be technical and boring, have fun making art, it´s what it´s about right? Experiment and be true to your own vision let no one stand in your way. But if you need to know about something, check online first and then maybe buy a highly recommended book. Libraries are also useful. And the best method of learning the art is by watching the movies ofcourse, I know it´s been mentioned already...

Oh yeah, try and specialize on one area in the filmmaking process like directing for instance. Cause these days things are very much like that. No one wants a jack of all trades, master of none nubkin on their set. And who wants to make their own coffee when some other muppet can make it for them?

Hope this adds some flavour to you confused peeps out there...

(I´ve been away so excuse my delay in reply...)

Regards
Reminiscence

Maty · Nov 3, 2006

Hey,

I know that it is a somewhat delayed reply; unfortunatlly, I did not have a chance to check in lately. I appreciete you folks taking the time to post your thoughts and comments even in my absance, thanks!
I'm eager to check the links posted.

As for the issue of film school, I decided against it for the time being, and I'm currently working on a screenplay.

Again, I thank everyone for taking the time to post their views.

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