SAG Actors in a non-union movie?

[Glurrk]

(Not sure which forum this should have been in, thought I'd try this one...)

I've got a situation, I wonder if anyone's had a similar experience...

I'm trying to put together a feature and have had a casting call, letting all prospective actors know that it would be a non-paying shoot. (or deferred pay) Three of my actors are with SAG (Screen Actors' Guild), and it seems as though I can't find the proper paperwork to keep everyone out of trouble.

According to my research, SAG discourages its members from participating in a nonunion shoot. However, there must be some way around this, otherwise the three actors who showed up (and were cast) would not have bothered. The SAG offices do not return my calls, and my producer's efforts have netted nothing more than "there are no contracts that allow SAG actors to work for deferred pay" roadblocks from the same office.

There IS a "Ultra-Low Budget" contract, but we don't even have the money to cover this, as our investors decided to pass on our project, leaving us with just a few thousand $$$ of our own to get this thing going.

Anyone else run into this? Basically, I need to know what sort of paperwork I have to have to satisfy the powers that be (whoever they are) so no one gets into trouble. (I don't want my actors to jeopardize their careers, but I also want to avoid any headaches down the road, too!)

 

[Dan Selakovich]

The SAG ultra low budget agreement for actors is only $75 a day (at least it used to be). If you can't afford that, you might just have to get non-union actors if you want to stay out of trouble.

Dan

 

[Glurrk]

The SAG ultra low budget agreement for actors is only $75 a day (at least it used to be).

It's up to $100/day, now. I just lost my lead actor, the remaining two are sure to follow. :roll: We learn something new every day.

 

[Dan Selakovich]

The low budget agreement is a nasty thing anyway--ever read it? Personally, I'd never use it, and find a way to pay normal rates. In the end, financially anyway, you're probably better off going non-union. You CAN find good non-union talent (as you can find really bad union talent). Try putting a casting notice in Dramalogue or something like that. Just add more time in pre-production for casting!

Dan

 

[Kim Welch]

Post call for cast in the classifieds

Post call for cast in the classifieds

You can post in the classfieds and you can also post in teh acting section here. I think it is ok to allow posting for honest casting calls in the acting section and you can def post in the www.studentfilmmakersforums.com/classifieds

Truly
Kim

 

[alonerdottiearebel]

Backstage West is another good place to post ads for casting.

I've worked on SAG Experimental Agreements where you don't have to pay the actors unless your film gets picked up for distribution. If it is a short, you frequently will only use it for festivals and reels so you'll never have to pay them a salary.

I believe all SAG contracts require you to pay mileage for the actors to get from home to the set. Also, in the SAG Experimental agreements in the fine print, it basically says the actor can walk off at any time if they get a paying gig.

I don't think the filmmakers can get in trouble for hiring SAG actors for a non-union project. I think the actor are the ones who risk being fined or cut from the union. Anyone else have more detailed information on this?

 

[tiramisushi]

also try nowcasting.com. it's free! you can specify non union only in the posting (even though i still get SAG actors who send me headshots).

if you do end up using a SAG actor who willingly appears in a non-union movie, what are the consequences?

will the producer have to pay any sort of fine? will it affect distribution? will it affect future productions that might have larger budgets and SAG contracts?

 

[Glurrk]

if you do end up using a SAG actor who willingly appears in a non-union movie, what are the consequences?

As far as I know, it is the union actors who are at risk by agreeing to a non-union shoot. The filmmakers aren't at any risk provided you tell them up front that this is a nonunion gig.

The actors who are caught get drawn & quartered, and their remains are sprinkled onto ant hills and forgotten. :wink:

No, seriously, the actors get fined a sum of money- some will choose to use an alias if they really want to work on your film, so always talk things out.

 

[Burbank Blah Blah Blah]

As a SAG actor, I would like to say THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU for refusing to use SAG actors in your project. There is something called Rule 1 in SAG, and it *is* the first rule listed in the Things Thou Shall and Shall NOT Do When A SAG Member. And that Number One thing is: Thou Shalt Not Work Non-SAG. EVER. For ANY REASON.

SAG members who agree to do non-SAG work are "supposed to" get in BIG trouble with SAG. But I've never seen it happen. Unless you are a "star" and you make a stink about something that gets a lot of press, then SAG jumps on it to save face...

Anyway, don't reward those SAG people with a gig! If they want to work non-SAG, they should turn in their SAG cards. There are a LOT of talented people who are ~not~ SAG. Just cuz you are SAG card doesn't automatically make you a fab actor.

As for production getting in trouble, yes, that's supposed to happen, too. Prod. is supposed to get fined, but I don't know how much. I know that large budget projects are very careful about that, cuz it *would* mean major money for them, after they turn in their paperwork & SAG does whatever it does to cross-reference the talent.

Getting hold of SAG: don't know why you are having that much of a problem: whenever I call, I get put on hold for just a couple of minutes, then get connected to whatever dept. I was calling...

Have I blabbed on enuff?
Okay.
C-ya.
~Burbank BBB~

 

[shaun2042]

You can't get in trouble.

You can't get in trouble.

Just to answer your question though it's probably to late. Yes, you can use them, and no you can't get into trouble. They can get kicked out of SAG for acting in a non-SAG movie. However, you can not get in trouble or recieve any fines unless you are a SAG Signator (you sign a contract that states you will always use SAG actors and only SAG actors.) If you haven't signed a contract they can't do anything to you. Also, in Lloyd Kaufmans book (Owner of Troma) he says all you have to do to keep the actors from getting in trouble is to list them in the credits under a fake name. I think that sounds dumb, but he says he's done it on many movies. I'm a member of the Teamster union, and when I shoot my first feature, I'm not going to use any unions, even though I'm a member of one of those units. Why? Beacuse I can't afford it. So don't worry about it. If they want to be in your movie then use them, let them worry about the fall out. Thise who say only use SAG are worried about the money. If you have money, you can get SAG actors in the worst films. So its not based on quality, only the money.

 

[filmdude]

WOrking with Union and non-Union Actors in same film

WOrking with Union and non-Union Actors in same film

Hi,
I have dealt with all that is being discussed here so may have the ability to clear things up.

In the past year the contracts were rewritten. So where one was once allowed to use Union and non-union actors in films with no pay, that is no longer allowed. One can, however pay their union actors at the rate of $100 dollars per day and try to shoot out all their scenes asap utilizing the non-union performers for the majority of the time.

To my knowledge the only other way around this, and you certainly won't hear about this from SAG, although it is a clause which they allow, is to ask the SAG members to go FINANCIAL CORE which allows them to continue along as SAG members but also work on non-paying, non-union gigs. This was institued by Charlton Heston when he was a member so he could make westerns in Mexico. Only downside for the actor is they can't be nominated for a SAG award or get the SAG newsletter. Otherwise they have all the same rights as any other member. And...they can be reinstated if they should decide to jump back into the guild. They try to scare off members by saying it's at their discretion, but so is everything else they do. They generally let them have their full status back unless they committed a serious breech.

 

[Glurrk]

Getting hold of SAG: don't know why you are having that much of a problem: whenever I call, I get put on hold for just a couple of minutes, then get connected to whatever dept. I was calling...

You're a union member; of course they'll speak to you!

Non-members (the rest of us) are viewed by the SAG office personnel as filth-ridden, stinking vermin whose parents were unmarried and whose putrid ichor nauseates all sentient beings with a SAG card. :roll:


:wink:

Just to answer your question though it's probably to late.

Yes, production wrapped back in July, and the rough cut was finished back in early September. But thanks anyway! (Maybe someone else can make use of this information!)