JVC GY-HD100U
- Thread starter Kim Welch
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D
Digigenic
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Initially, there was some hype for the JVC GY-HD100U when they snuck it out as a preemptive strike on its HDV counterparts mid March [see http://www.studentfilmmakersforums.com/bb/viewtopic.php?t=974 March 16th] which kind of kick started the shock and awe phase of the wonder that was to follow…Panasonic’s HVX200. A one-two punch formula if you will…as JVC and Panasonic are siblings under parent company Matsushita. I touched on this 8 months ago in another post [see http://www.studentfilmmakersforums.com/bb/viewtopic.php?t=512 August/04] outlining a course of action between JVC and Panasonic to position itself in offering true HD to the prosumer, a prediction that despite its criticism from others actually became a reality…hmmmm, that reminds me, I should probably follow up on that thread.
Anyhow, the JVC is an interesting prospect, but it’s unclear as to whether or not this camera will actually perform as good as it looks. The open body architecture, direct to disk drive system, and *supposed* 1/3 to ½ HD series lenses are strong points for this camera, but it still doesn’t change the fact that it’s using an entirely new codec, JVC’s Pro HD HDV codec, which in and of itself remains HDV with a few quirks, particularly with the audio delay issue, casting even more doubt in the compatibility and reliability department.
Bottom line, all of these HD/HDV cameras have their uses. There will certainly be users for the JVC GY-HD100U, many of which will likely be indie filmmakers. But, it should be understood that based on specs and compatibility factors, none of the HDV cameras really stands head and shoulders above the competition. Notice though, I say HDV, not HD. The Panasonic HVX200 is HD, and it does stand head and shoulders above its competition, because it has no competition.
Having this advantage comes at a cost though, a cost that when factoring in the recording (P2 and hard drives) runs significantly higher than the HDV cameras with tape or disk drive. So, the prosumer, with so many choices at hand, is put in yet another interesting position again.
Anyhow, the JVC is an interesting prospect, but it’s unclear as to whether or not this camera will actually perform as good as it looks. The open body architecture, direct to disk drive system, and *supposed* 1/3 to ½ HD series lenses are strong points for this camera, but it still doesn’t change the fact that it’s using an entirely new codec, JVC’s Pro HD HDV codec, which in and of itself remains HDV with a few quirks, particularly with the audio delay issue, casting even more doubt in the compatibility and reliability department.
Bottom line, all of these HD/HDV cameras have their uses. There will certainly be users for the JVC GY-HD100U, many of which will likely be indie filmmakers. But, it should be understood that based on specs and compatibility factors, none of the HDV cameras really stands head and shoulders above the competition. Notice though, I say HDV, not HD. The Panasonic HVX200 is HD, and it does stand head and shoulders above its competition, because it has no competition.
Having this advantage comes at a cost though, a cost that when factoring in the recording (P2 and hard drives) runs significantly higher than the HDV cameras with tape or disk drive. So, the prosumer, with so many choices at hand, is put in yet another interesting position again.
K
Kev T
Guest
GY HD100 vs HVX 200
GY HD100 vs HVX 200
While the JVC GY HD100 is meant as a competitor to the Sony HDV camcorders, (as well as to ride on Sony's HDV bandwagon), the Panasonic HVX 200 is as mentioned before a true HD camcorder using the same DVCPro HD platform as their top of the line Varicam model.
However, IMHO Panasonic did not think through the HVX 200's target market with their inplemenation of the P2 recording media...
The HVX 200 is slated to sell for about USD 6000. Two 8Gb P2 cards cost a large fraction of the sum total, and only provides about 30 minutes recording... Buy another 2 more P2 cards? Suddenly, the HVX200 is no longer a $6000 investment, but much more...
However, workflow on shooting with only 2 cards is untenable, shoot 30 min. Take time out to off-load the cards... Even with another 2 cards for contious shooting, you'll still need an additional crew to off load the cards onto HDD to get them ready for use again. Extra crew, extra Laptop and terabyte storage to be on location.
What is the point of the low cost and small form factor of the HVX200 then? You can't do a one-man shoot with this camera at all. A stealthy camera that requires a larger crew and more gear on site goes against the grain of indie production philosophy!
This really prompt one to ask if the Panasonic designers actually went out with the HVX200 prototypes to shoot a production at all? The only use I see for this model then is to use it as the POV unit in conjunction with the Varicam as the main unit in a much larger production set-up.
Kev T
GY HD100 vs HVX 200
While the JVC GY HD100 is meant as a competitor to the Sony HDV camcorders, (as well as to ride on Sony's HDV bandwagon), the Panasonic HVX 200 is as mentioned before a true HD camcorder using the same DVCPro HD platform as their top of the line Varicam model.
However, IMHO Panasonic did not think through the HVX 200's target market with their inplemenation of the P2 recording media...
The HVX 200 is slated to sell for about USD 6000. Two 8Gb P2 cards cost a large fraction of the sum total, and only provides about 30 minutes recording... Buy another 2 more P2 cards? Suddenly, the HVX200 is no longer a $6000 investment, but much more...
However, workflow on shooting with only 2 cards is untenable, shoot 30 min. Take time out to off-load the cards... Even with another 2 cards for contious shooting, you'll still need an additional crew to off load the cards onto HDD to get them ready for use again. Extra crew, extra Laptop and terabyte storage to be on location.
What is the point of the low cost and small form factor of the HVX200 then? You can't do a one-man shoot with this camera at all. A stealthy camera that requires a larger crew and more gear on site goes against the grain of indie production philosophy!
This really prompt one to ask if the Panasonic designers actually went out with the HVX200 prototypes to shoot a production at all? The only use I see for this model then is to use it as the POV unit in conjunction with the Varicam as the main unit in a much larger production set-up.
Kev T
Do they actually have a prototype? I thought the only thing they'd shown was a mockup of the exterior of the camera?
I agree, though: while it sounds like it will produce a good picture if it's released, I don't see the market for it. For the cost of the camera plus P2 cards plus laptop plus tape backup plus people to handle the support tasks, I'd rather rent a real HD camera.
K
Kev T
Guest
JVC GY HD100 steals a march on Canon
JVC GY HD100 steals a march on Canon
I've not seen the actual JVC GY HD100 ProHDV camcorder yet, as I'm in Singapore and did not make the trip to NAB. However we should see it during the forthcoming Broadcast Asia show in Singapore by mid June.
When I first looked at the photos of this camcorder from JVC's website, I instantly thought to myself, "Gee, its an all black Canon XL model with a flip-out LCD screen!"
Unlike Panasonic not having thought out the HVX200 product especially in terms of shooting workflow as mentioned in my earlier post, I feel that JVC as the 'poor cousin' in the Matsushita conglomerate actually put a lot of thought into the HD100.
While the Sonys and Panasonics relie on fixed lens bearing fancy branding from Carl Zeiss and E Leitz respectively, only the JVC allows a choice of lens other than the standard 16x Fujinon, and a range of 1/2' format lenses from both Canon & Fujinon. One can also bet on other smaller 3rd party optical vendors such as Century Precision Optics and Optex, etc coming up with more choices.
I'm also certain that P+S technik will have a version of their mini35 adaptor for this camera to accept Arri/Zeiss PL mount primes lenses, or for that matter, any Pl mount lenses from Angenieux & Cooke too!
With such choices, why bother with consumer grade Leitz and Zeiss glass fitted to the Sonys and Panasonics? (With Zeiss Master Primes or Cooke S-4s mounted via the P+S Mini35 on a GY HD100, the HVX200 user will be the 'poor cousin' instead!
Its form factor takes much from the Canon XL series and therefore would entice upgraders who are current owners/users of the XL system. I'm one such person who was just that little bit disappointed when I discovered that the Canon XL-2 wasn't going to be HDV...
Despite being one of the original ratifying parties to the HDV format, I think it is sad that Canon is going about so very slowly with their entry to HDV. Compared to their lead in the professional digital stills camera inductry, Canon's HDV products have so far been non-events.
So with all the above, come this July when JVC starts shipping the GY HD100, they will, for the first time be in a unique position of having a product on their hands that will allow them to make serious dents into Sony's, Panasonic's and Canon's traditional strangle-hold on the hotly contested Prosumer camcorder market.
Assuming of course, and that's a very big if... That Matsushita does not rein JVC in as they've done in the past, like what's happen with JVC's D-9 format and even D-VHS, etc, etc.
Kev
JVC GY HD100 steals a march on Canon
I've not seen the actual JVC GY HD100 ProHDV camcorder yet, as I'm in Singapore and did not make the trip to NAB. However we should see it during the forthcoming Broadcast Asia show in Singapore by mid June.
When I first looked at the photos of this camcorder from JVC's website, I instantly thought to myself, "Gee, its an all black Canon XL model with a flip-out LCD screen!"
Unlike Panasonic not having thought out the HVX200 product especially in terms of shooting workflow as mentioned in my earlier post, I feel that JVC as the 'poor cousin' in the Matsushita conglomerate actually put a lot of thought into the HD100.
While the Sonys and Panasonics relie on fixed lens bearing fancy branding from Carl Zeiss and E Leitz respectively, only the JVC allows a choice of lens other than the standard 16x Fujinon, and a range of 1/2' format lenses from both Canon & Fujinon. One can also bet on other smaller 3rd party optical vendors such as Century Precision Optics and Optex, etc coming up with more choices.
I'm also certain that P+S technik will have a version of their mini35 adaptor for this camera to accept Arri/Zeiss PL mount primes lenses, or for that matter, any Pl mount lenses from Angenieux & Cooke too!
With such choices, why bother with consumer grade Leitz and Zeiss glass fitted to the Sonys and Panasonics? (With Zeiss Master Primes or Cooke S-4s mounted via the P+S Mini35 on a GY HD100, the HVX200 user will be the 'poor cousin' instead!
Its form factor takes much from the Canon XL series and therefore would entice upgraders who are current owners/users of the XL system. I'm one such person who was just that little bit disappointed when I discovered that the Canon XL-2 wasn't going to be HDV...
Despite being one of the original ratifying parties to the HDV format, I think it is sad that Canon is going about so very slowly with their entry to HDV. Compared to their lead in the professional digital stills camera inductry, Canon's HDV products have so far been non-events.
So with all the above, come this July when JVC starts shipping the GY HD100, they will, for the first time be in a unique position of having a product on their hands that will allow them to make serious dents into Sony's, Panasonic's and Canon's traditional strangle-hold on the hotly contested Prosumer camcorder market.
Assuming of course, and that's a very big if... That Matsushita does not rein JVC in as they've done in the past, like what's happen with JVC's D-9 format and even D-VHS, etc, etc.
Kev
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